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BALANCE & TRUING OF FLYWHEELS - YouTube Not a lot of $ so you may be good tehre. There are a lot of different components to work with and remove before even getting to the clutch pack and when you finally do, you have to install the clutch and flywheel perfectly and then put everything back together so as to ensure you dont have to do the job again. SPEC maintains a one-one-thousandth machine tolerance to assure a perfect rotational integrity, fast clutch seating, and maximized drivability. After the install I noticed a vibration at 1,500 rpm. The balancing machine in the picture is supposed to have the piece being . Norton/SPEC:How a specific application responds to driveline inertia depends on vehicle weight, gearing, and engine power curve. The boys here get $125. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. Steve (CTR). ), http://www.clubcobra.com/photopost/dall_Small_.jpg, ERA #732 - Pics from the ERA Owners Gallery. They have adapters that will allow you to balance anything if the center hole is clean without burrs. FW Clutch have rebuilt a number of NLA clutches for vintage cars we've worked on. The style of driving or racing will usually determine the need for a specific style clutch, which will strictly translate to the type of flywheel necessary as well. This is done by adding weight to the outer extremities of the cover. Cobra Make, Engine: ERA #732, 428FE (447 CID), TKO600, Solid Flat Tappet Cam, Tons of Aluminum. This video shows how I went about balancing my LC Engineering flywheel (35 lb steel) and AISIN CTX-107 pressure plate. Question on flywheel balance, vibration after clutch swap Really !!!!! Mine is but a fairly standard 1293 (because that was the bore available) but with new bits - cam/lifters/push rods, connecting rods, crank, lightweight flywheel, clutch. All rotating bits will be balanced by a shop that has done A Series engines for quite some timeincluding my 1380at a cost of $125 (price for 4 cylinder engines). I've come to realize that nothing has been done to this car by the previous owner's except for basic matinance, even though i was told other wise. Issues can still come up if the two pieces are not balanced together, creating small problems like vibrations or chatter, or even larger issues like crank bearing wear, seal wear, or worse. From the factory, your '82 to '95 Mustangs came with a 10 inch clutch. x=nIyX\hdw`1JD){58QY$eq_[>6?7|%Y5yVIIz,^u[mU4]urvy]&E$r Wg(G'jyiV%' states "Hays recommends balancing clutch/flywheel as assembly before installation." The paperwork also states "Balance with crank if possible." Paperwork identifies this next to a problem of "Vibration at high RPM." All I have seen are junk. Check out this cutaway of an Optimum-SR clutch from Quarter Master which features a billet aluminum lightweight flywheel. I have nothing to gain from leading you astray. Flywheel | O'Reilly Auto Parts All of our aluminum flywheels include a hardened steel friction surface that is designed to be replaced versus being resurfaced. The flywheel mates to the clutch pressure plate and crankshaft, and the pressure plate can decouple from the flywheel when the clutch is disengaged. If the flywheel is too worn and cannot be resurfaced, then it is advisable to replace the whole thing with a new part. Doing the rods, pistons and crank with all rotating parts other than disc current price is $250 to $280. Every company manufactures its flywheel for different applications, power outputs, and overall drivability. You can get your damper repaired at this place. The clutch cover was also out of balance (about 20 grams). Rotating assembly will be shipped internally balanced. Jenkins/Fidanza:The most common material types includesteel, aluminum, and nodular iron. %PDF-1.5 Website content, text, & images Copyright 2023 LMR.com - All Rights Reserved. Steve (CTR). Your cast iron flywheel, obviously, that's a great stock replacement even for mild bolt-ons. They make/rebuild clutches with Kevlar and ceramic, and can balance the flywheel and pressure plate (not disc/diaphram). While the flywheel is not an obscure component to comprehend, selecting the proper flywheel for a specific application is often shrouded in mystery for manyenthusiasts. George Hovsepian, Quarter Master. Have you tried to spin it with the presure plate moved around one hole at a time untill you find the best spot first? Your E-Mail and/or password are incorrect. His passion for anything that is fast, or has a V8, brought him to Power Automedia. As you drive a manual transmission car, the clutch is constantly coming in contact with the flywheel when you release the clutch pedal. Here's why: Although the C5 does have its clutch and flywheel attached to the crankshaft, as has been done with all Vettes since the '53, the car's driveline differs from that of its predecessors . Many applications have little-to-no drivability downsides when utilizing a light flywheel. Just my 02c. It will be set up in a spin balancing machine to be run up to a speed of several hundred RPM to measure vibration. Hovsepian/Quarter Master:A heavy flywheel (to a certain extent) allows for an easier transition from a standstill to operation. Reducing weight (or MOI) will reduce the time it takes to reach maximum RPM, which is optimal for most road-racing and autocross applications. Every piece also needs to be indexed so that you get back in the exact place that it was balanced. I know this sounds funny because the crank ass'y should be balanced in it's own right. Was a 50 ounce imbalance flywheel and it's a very common upgrade to make those a 10 and 1/2 inch whenever you go to swap out the clutch. Our flywheels are built for racing and performance. But you should take the pair to a good machine shop and have the dynamic balance checked and adjusted if necessary. let them pistons reach for the stars. Add to that the flywheel and clutch when used on an externally balanced crank need to be balanced with the crank assembly which means the engine has tp come apart. Spec 3 and Fedenza, no balancing no problems. We do offer a lineup of steel flywheels that do not have a replaceable friction surface. This eliminates any imperfections on the surface and ensures a proper seating position in the clutch assembly, ultimately protecting the assembly and creating a safeguard. I now have a noticeable vibration above 3000 rpm. The tighter or closer to zero the tolerance, the more balanced the unit will be. Reply. The friction surface material and inertia most directly affect how the clutch feels to the end user, and will ultimately dictate other factors, such as performance and wear life., Our flywheels are designed as a direct OEM replacement, which means they willmeetor exceed all factory tolerances. Also replaced axles (Leobro's) No problems of this type before engine drop. These engines needed more weight to balance them so Detroit put some of the extra needed weight . flywheel. This is, of course, after the flywheel has been balanced as well. Jenkins/Fidanza:It is highly recommended to balance the flywheel and clutch assembly together before installing them into the vehicle. We promise not to use your email address for anything but exclusive updates from the Power Automedia Network. I just had the Spec III put in my car using the stock flywheel. As received, a new flywheel from the factory should be balanced within some industry standard, like a few grams or a few ounce-inches. 10046031 Flywheel Dowel (Big-Block) Highly recommended for all high-performance and competition Big-Block engines; 1453658 Bellhousing Dowel and Clutch Housing/Transmission . With that in mind we asked each for some strong tips, tricks, and general words of wisdom and information for enthusiasts regarding flywheel selection. JavaScript is disabled. OK, I just found out my engine rebuilder DOES do balancing. When parts for the old balance machine went NLA they spent $28000. YES! and maybe re-balanced any time it is machined for clean-up or weight reduction. Do flywheel and clutch assembly have to match? Depending on the severity of the imbalance, it could lead to serious damage to the entire driveline if the issue is not addressed. Steve (CTR). Hope this helps some. Norton/SPEC:The flywheel is the component that contributes the mostto the performance and the overall drivability of the clutch system. Sold to Kens06. This is also why companies manufacture heavier weighted flywheels. balancing flywheel with rotating assembly | Ford Mustang Forum The boys here get $125. As such, the flywheel can obtain hot spots due to the excessive friction and heat over time, which in turn can cause vibration whenever its engaging and when the vehicle is under acceleration. I recently purchased a Hays clutch kit along with a new flywheel and in the "Dos & Dont's Problems" paperwork from Hays. Mal stop me man, Hey I'm OK. If the flywheel and clutch assembly are out of balance, noise, vibration, and harshness levels will dramatically increase, and will inevitably cause extreme damage to the engine, transmission, or driveline. I had a really bad vibration. Yea,..you have to have everything that rotates including the washers and bolts and..andand send it to the shop and watch them balance it with the crank and all the parts attached to the crank. We want to get to know you.Stay connected with us. The correct tolerances would be matched to what the OEM toleranceis, although this will vary per application. I just got my flywheel and clutch back from the machine shop. The clutch plate/disc does not get balanced with the assembly. Not so great for drag racing, because you lose the inertia that you need to get the car moving right off the starting line. I'm sure there are more, that's who our shop and myself have used. Its a good idea in a high performnce application to balance the rotating assembly with the damper and flywheel. The SFI Foundation, Inc. (SFI) is a non-profit organization established to issue and administer standards for the quality assurance of specialty performance and racing equipment. Check out LMR's flywheel guide for all of the answers! FAQ's - Fidanza Performance The goal is to make a power application the most efficient, as its not always about where the car is driven. 1 0 obj Crank flange bolt pattern/sealing arrangement. The down side is i didn't include the cost for these new parts in my engine rebuild buget :0( Oh' well there's no saving these parts, so i gotta get em all new Man this is an expensive hobby! They are balanced and no metal had to come off or be added. No vibration before or after the 1500 rpm mark. Discussing Weighted Versus Lightweight Flywheel Options. for a new computer driven machine. Each manufacturer has its own unique process for creating flywheels. Balancing flywheel and clutch assembly together? If you're going to be visiting the track a bunch, doing a bunch of high RPM clutch dumps on sticky tires, probably not the best choice. Also, enthusiasts must prioritize performance and drivability. Machinist will match mark the PP and flywheel so you assemble them in the same fashion that they were balanced. - asinine not to imo. Since this is such a massive part with large diameter, it has to be balanced, and the factory usually does a pretty good job of it. He indicated that 4 cylinder cranks usually are fine and don't need balancing. Copyright 2021 action clutch. If it's a puck-type clutch, you're going to want to use either a billet steel or billet aluminum flywheel because a cast iron flywheel will just chew itself up. Exactly !!!!! Also of mention is that sometimes shops balance the flywheel . Hovsepian/Quarter Master:Whether its a lightweightor neutral weightedflywheel, itmust be balanced no question about it. The flywheel is a component of a manual transmission that helps to transfer power from the engine to the transmission. Action Clutch specifically designed our Chromoly flywheels for a reduction in weight and inertia for better engine response. The lighter a flywheel is, the faster it spools up RPM; but also means the harder it is to start from a standstill. Build your own custom newsletter with the content you love from LSX Magazine, directly to your inbox, absolutely FREE! As long as it can be mounted on his balancer. Flywheel Tolerance What Is It? Login with your E-Mail Address. When a clutch assembly begins to wear outandneeds to be replaced, the friction surface of that flywheel in that clutch assembly is often resurfaced instead of being replaced. Chromoly flywheels are an excellent choice for any performance or stock build. Any usage or mentions of these terms throughout our website and print ads are used for identification purposes only. Any factory engine or any rebuilt factory engine is going to take a 50-ounce imbalance flywheel. The factory might use round weights to be riveted onto the edge of the cover. I need to take in my pressure plate and flywheel. I have a vibration that starts a little over 2000 RPM and seems to fade way above 3000 RPM. Mustang & Lightning Tech, Articles, How To Videos, 94-04 Mustang Tech, Articles, How To Videos, SVE Flywheel - Billet Steel - 10.5" - 0/28/50oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8, Cast Iron Flywheel - 10.5" - 50oz (79-95) 5.0, McLeod Flywheel - Nodular Iron - 10.5" - 50oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8, Ford Performance Flywheel - Billet Steel - 10.5" - 50oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8, Ram Flywheel - Billet Steel - 10.5" - 50oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8, McLeod Flywheel - Aluminum - 10"/10.5" - 0/28/50oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8, Ram Flywheel - Aluminum - 10.5" - 50oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8, Ram Flywheel - Billet Steel - 10.5" - 28oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8, Ram Flywheel - Aluminum - 10.5" - 28oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8, Ford Performance Flywheel - Billet Steel - 10.5" - 0oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8. The whole assembly is then spun up to measure vibration, and the clutch cover (pressure plate assembly) is then balanced. TECH GUIDE: Choosing a Ford Flywheel - What You Need To Know <>/ExtGState<>/Font<>/ProcSet[/PDF/Text/ImageB/ImageC/ImageI] >>/Annots[ 22 0 R] /MediaBox[ 0 0 612 792] /Contents 4 0 R/Group<>/Tabs/S/StructParents 0>> Any guidance would be appreciated. Balancing a flywheel is very important for rotational integrity and safety, and drivability. Flywheel Alignment and Balance - FreeASEStudyGuides.com The balancing machine in the picture is supposed to have the piece being balanced spun , not too fast maybe 800 - 1000 rpm . Norton/SPEC:SPEC flywheels are precision-balanced before shipment, as well as balance-checked after being paired with a clutch assembly, which is also balanced after production. Design by: PelicanParts.com | Powered by vBulletin Version 3.8.7Copyright 2000 - 2023, vBulletin Solutions, Inc. I am still welcome to drop by and use any machine in the shop. The manufacturers we involved in this article have dedicated an immenseamount of research and engineering to develop a high-performance, highly capable flywheel for virtually any application imaginable. You may want to go ahead and step up to billet steel. Any imbalance will be felt , like a road wheel out of balance. After the flywheel is well balanced, the clutch assembly can then be mounted on the flywheel with the friction disc very carefully centered. If my crankshaft has only been reduced by .010 and .010 mains and rods is shouldnt change the factory balancing. how to install and prime the oil pump??? This video shows how I went about balancing my LC Engineering flywheel (35 lb steel) and AISIN CTX-107 pressure plate. 4 0 obj From the factory, your '82 to '95 Mustangs came with a ten-inch clutch and was a fifty-ounce imbalance flywheel. If I was you, I would get the short block, take the crank out , at least ,( you should do the pistons too), and find a balance shop. Balancing_flywheel__pressure_plate_and_clutch - Mini Mania Last theory I heard on the FW and PP was that they could be balanced individually, but it was more important to make sure the flywheel jived with the crank. If the flywheel and clutch assembly are out of balance, noise, vibration, and harshness levels will dramatically increase,and will inevitably cause extreme damage to the engine, transmission, or driveline. Late Model Restoration has no affiliation with Ford Motor Company, Roush Enterprises, Eaton, or Saleen. Action Clutch Flywheels are designed and tested to ensure the best quality and performance. These different types of flywheels do not necessarily affect the clutch assembly or operation, as most are actually designed to work with specific style clutches to avoid any adverse affects. Not saying it would be a bad choice in the streetcar, but you will notice you take a little bit more clutch slip to get the car moving. If you put a 28 oz flywheel, one that has a 28 oz weight tacked on somewhere on the outer circumference of the flywheel , the motor will vibrate like mad, eventually breaking something. Colin Mc Rae MBE 1968-2007.Give a car more power and it goes faster on the straights,make a car lighter and it's faster everywhere. I want to register an account for free right now! Saleen is a registered trademark of Saleen Incorporated. Jenkins/Fidanza:Both styles of flywheel can be found on the market. For not a lot of money the crank could/should be done also. Replaced my Clutch (Sachs) and flywheel (Sebro) on my 88 911, and now have a vibration/chatter at low RPM's (2000 - 2500) under load/acceleration progressively worse in higher gears. Additionally, on the manufacturing side,we heat press, fasten and in certain applications even weld ring gears to our flywheels. For starters, it provides the initial inertia to get the engine running and also provides the rotational inertia to keep it going, otherwise, the engine would stall when you lift your foot off the gas. Check with the vehicle manufacturer for testing specifications. Doing the rods, pistons and crank with all rotating parts other than disc current price is $250 to $280. With so many choices on the market today, it can be difficult to choose the right one for a specific application. We make sure to not go too light to prevent poor idle and driving issues like some of the ultra-lightweight brands. Now from '86 to '95, all the clutches were upgraded to the 10 1/2 inch version that we know today. :0). The lighter a flywheel is, the faster it spools up RPM; but also means the harder it is to start from a standstill. MSC offers new as well as several other suppliers. Any of your stroker motors or engines that have had custom balancing work done are typically going to take a twenty-eight-ounce imbalance, but it could use a zero neutral imbalance. PP and flywheel get balanced as an assembly, the disc does not. If in doubt, flat out. Our Chromoly lightweight flywheels have gone through and passed engineering tests up to 15,000-18,000 RPM.All our Chromoly Flywheels are heat treated for extreme durability and saves you money by resurfacing multiple times. The flywheel is an important part of the clutch assembly. endobj 289 Flywheel Installation | Mustang Forums at StangNet non biased Shelby Cobra related site! Resurfacing Your Clutch/Flywheel - YouTube Out of the box, the LCE flywheel was o. Balance flywheel/pressure plate yourself - Club Cobra Aluminum is too soft, and titanium is too hard for most friction materials. Many SPEC aluminum flywheel options, as well as certain steel flywheels feature a replaceable friction surface. with stanchion tube ultra low friction oil. If that's the case, you can use a neutral balanced flywheel. That must be a clutch only price. Your dime do what you want but over the years i have seen and heard about many non Mini machine shops and their opinions of what needs to be done and not and the engine failures/problems soon after re builds. <> This is the heavy spot. Posts: 7,924. They have had run out in and out up and down. Register now for free! A quick weight comparison between the C5's OEM clutch vs the new SPEC clutch shows a respectable 15-pound weight reduction. For example, a very light flywheel can make a clutch feel more aggressive. If you look at the flywheel amd front pulley they have holes around the outer edge. From the factory, your '82 to '95 Mustangs came with a 10 inch clutch. Please try again. These types of vehicles require a bit more weight to maintain proper idle and to get the momentum to move off the line. I keep a crank on hand that has been balanced by it's self to use as a mandrel to mount front or rear bits for balance. Is this a good idea? 475 rwhp 450 rwtq. Balancing doesn't "have" to be done, and race builders also alter the balance to allow for some positive benefits by overbalancing. And when it comes to the clutch assembly, one important component of that assortmentis often times overlooked. stream West Los Angeles. However,a lightweight flywheel isnt always ideal depending on the application. Just order the clutch/flywheel from DTE. Flywheel Balancing | Team Camaro Tech balancing , align-bore, tell him, you want the competition package done on her. If you don't have your shaft balanced you will have wasted your money. We check for many things when engineering a flywheel, such as overall balance, flywheel clearances or how improve the design. However, when you get into the options from all of your aftermarket companies, you'll either have billet steel, billet aluminum, or both in fifty-ounce imbalance, twenty-ounce, and even a complete zero neutral balance. In most cases, a ring gear can be replaced after starter damage or failure, without the end user having to purchase a completely new unit. This is known as "Detroit Balance". 5.0Resto, SVE, LMR are registered trademarks of Latemodel Restoration Supply, Inc. Ford, SVT, Special Vehicle Team, Ford Mustang, Ford Lightning, Mach 1, Mach-E, Shelby GT500, GT350, GT350R, New Edge, Boss 302, 5.0, Cobra R, Fox Body Mustang, Ghia, Turbo GT, SVT Cobra, Cobra Jet, Bullitt, California Special, Cobra, GT, V6, S197, SN95, S550, S650, Dark Horse, F-Series, F-150, Triton, F150 Raptor, Raptor, EcoBoost, Bronco, Bronco Sport, Badlands, Big Bend, Black Diamond, Outer Banks, Wildtrak, and Sasquatch are all registered trademarks of Ford Motor Company. The flywheel also balances the engine as it is specifically weighted the engines crankshaft, and most importantly, the flywheel connects the engine to the transmission through the clutch in order to provide power to the wheels. As dear old dad said advice is worth what it costs you and this I give you free. Four cyl engines have the worst natural balance characteristics. The bike is back together and it is very smooth. Flywheel Clutch Balancing Information Help Please I would balance them before I put them in so you don't have the same problem I'm having. VerticalScope Inc., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. For starters, you have your stock style, cast iron replacement flywheels. On top of that, considering how long it takes to change out a clutch and flywheel set, its probably a good idea to do everything the correct way the first time around. A neutral balanced flywheel or flexplate means that it isn't balanced out of balance or what is called "Detroit-balanced" like the 400SB and 454BB that are both "externally-balanced" engines. to do the flywheel, back plate diaphram, pulley and damper using my balanced crank. and this is just the tip of the iceberg. "DETROIT" FLYWHEEL BALANCE - Certain model engines now being produced have incorporated a counter weight in the flywheel to compensate for the lack of counter weight in the crankshaft. 2 0 obj A device like that will show the heavy spot at 6 o'clock but it doesn't tell you how much to take off, bit of "hit and miss". Check out our YouTube channel for even more tech tips, installation videos, how-tos, and more. The question is, do enthusiasts have to balance the parts themselves? I trust my engine rebuilder implicitly. Please Select your car type Below: Select Your Car Type to Ensure Proper Part Fitment. FOLLOW: All our aluminum flywheels are CAD designed/engineered and precision CNC machined from top quality billet aluminum forgings to strict tolerances for optimum performance and reliability. David Norton, SPEC Clutch. Copyright 2023 Endgame360 Inc. All Rights Reserved. Balancing Flywheel and Clutch -- EB-102 1982-95 Mustang Flywheel Guide - LMR.com The machine then shows where to remove weight and how much weight is to be removed, which is usually done by drilling holes in a non-contact area near the rim of the flywheel. Jenkins/Fidanza:One of the biggest issues that an enthusiastmay overlook is ensuring the friction area is clean of debris and greases or oils before installing the flywheel. Hovsepian/Quarter Master: Whether it's a lightweight or neutral weighted flywheel, it must be balanced no question about it.